Is running a kitchen really that different from running a football team? According to Rob, the answer is no — and his story proves it.
Introduction
In this episode of Sutton United Talk Time on Podcast, I sat down with Rob, who many of you will know as the man now in charge of food and hospitality at Sutton United. From Michelin star kitchens to Formula 1 paddocks, from artisan chocolate to Gander Green Lane, Rob’s career has been anything but ordinary. We talked about his journey, his inspirations, and most importantly, his vision for transforming the matchday experience for Sutton fans.
Mike Dowling
Hello and welcome to a special episode of Sutton United Talk Time on podcast. It's another little peek behind the amber curtain. In association with Lucky Star Gin, I'm your host, Mike. Welcome back to everyone who's a regular listener and hello to anyone who's joining us for the first time.
Mike Dowling
Today, I'm delighted to talk to someone who really didn't have a choice in his career because his name is Rob the Chef, I believe. Hello, Rob. How are you? I'm
Rob K
good. I'm good. I'm good. lovely to be on here finally we finally got there we've been trying to get us locked down for so long
Mike Dowling
we did indeed it was uh finally the diary's kind of aligned and i was like right we're going now but um it's been a bit of a busy summer for you um have you uh had much time to sort of sit back and think what the hell is going on what have i done
Rob K
uh not really because we've spent much of the summer getting stuck into getting everything ready for the new season. And alongside my other business, it's kind of just been go, go, go. We've been loading everything in. over the four-week break.
Rob K
I think it's a four-week break we had. I'm not sure on the exact break time. It wasn't a break for us, basically. Yeah.
Rob K
And no, but it's, yeah, lots of preparation, lots of refurbishment of the club, new hospitality units outside, you know, menu planning, getting suppliers lined up, all those bits and pieces. It's been quite a, yeah, The players have rested, I haven't.
Mike Dowling
the fans are rested, it's behind the scenes at Football Cup, there's always everyone, go, go, go, we're all just quite happy on our holidays. But I've missed one of my slots, it's engagement, don't forget everyone, like, share, follow, retweet, comment, all the rest of the stuff that sort of gets this into front of more eyes. So Rob, I've done a little bit of research, your surname isn't The Chef, it's just every time anyone ever talks about you, it's Rob the Chef, Rob the Chef, or Chef Rob, as you said.
Rob K
Yeah, Ben likes to go with Chef Rob.
Mike Dowling
Chef Rob, yeah. So I've done a little bit of research, so some of this hopefully is vaguely true. You've credited your mum as a big inspiration to your cooking as growing up in Devon. What did she do?
Mike Dowling
What kind of sparks that interest in cooking and sort of what age are we talking?
Rob K
So we're talking pre-secondary school age, you know, picturesque on the stool next to mom while she's cooking for us. What's that taste like? You know, eating the cake batter when you're not meant to eat the cake batter. Yeah, that really, I always think that kind of spiked my interest in food.
Rob K
Yeah, it was yeah from a young age really everything Food related in the house. My mom was and still is Celiac so she's gluten-free so before it became a fad before it became on every single shelf in the in the supermarkets and we had to go and get her food from the pharmacy. It was crazy. It's bonkers to think that was the case.
Rob K
You had to get a prescription from a doctor to go and get food that she could eat that wouldn't make her sick. And so there would be a lot of care at home with her making the stuff that we could have and she could have. And So that was really, I found that really super interesting. And then, like, coming back home from school, it's like red peppers, green tomatoes, Ainsley Harriot.
Rob K
Mom would sit me down in front of that while she did whatever she was doing, or maybe going and doing something for one of my other siblings. And then I studied at school as well. My first job was in a pub near where I live. And that kind of, I guess, started everything, started the wheels in motion.
Rob K
Yeah. True to wicked. Yeah.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, it's interesting because obviously you'd be looking at these specialist foods and trying to say, well, we don't need it just to be fuel. It should be tasting nice as well. So you'd obviously have that from your childhood, which is interesting because, yeah, I'm a bit older and all that kind of stuff is a bit weird. It's just like, have that, that'll do.
Rob K
Yeah, it is amazing how food has evolved. But I think this the same what is amazing about food and how we as society utilize food is that it's still coming together of people. It's I mean, yeah, there are times when we sit and eat by ourselves and stuff like that. But that's probably because we're living a busy schedule.
Rob K
We're running around. But there's always with food there's always a coming together of people and um that's amazing it's that's one of the things we have and we still hold on to uh i love it there's nothing better than sitting around a table it doesn't happen very often with me um i'm up here in london and my a lot of my family are in dev so getting together at christmas or a wedding or a birthday you're around the table and you're sharing food and it's being done like that for since since the dawn of humankind. Cavemen era we're talking, you know, hunter-gatherer and I love that, I love that so much.
Mike Dowling
You mentioned you grew up in Devon and you trained in Devon and then you came to London and you're working with, I've got Michelin star chefs, what was that jump like from early working in a pub and then suddenly in the kitchen being shouted at?
Rob K
Well, no, I shouted that in the first kitchen as well. I shouted that in the pub. The pub that I worked at was an absolute machine. I went back to Devon a week or so ago, and I actually connected with one of the guys who started working there.
Rob K
I'm still friends with the people who work there, still now, or have left there, which is really special. You form this new bond in the kitchen. But then we were doing, it's seasonal, so it's busy in the summer, quiet in the winter, but we were doing peak August 700 covers on a Saturday with about 12, 15 people. That's insane.
Rob K
It's like crazy. They're still doing those types of numbers now when I call out with Jacques. It's incredible. So that was very intense, constant, constant go, go, go, go, go.
Rob K
You just didn't stop running. And then it became about sort of honing that in, maybe slowing down a little bit and refining the practices. Chef that I first started working with, Olivier, he, traditional French chef, amazing. But Sheltie, Sheltie, he was good and you learn a lot from him.
Rob K
Ian, a guy who a lot of my skills have come through from him. and Paul, the two, some people I cannot not mention, they were kind of the balance of the two, where they had done the whole shouted kitchen of the 90s and the 80s, and they were, I guess, I think it's the point in any chef's life where they're just over shouting, they're just done shouting, and it's like, you know, he was all about teaching and Yeah, when the push comes to shove, you gotta, you know, when people need to shout, they need to shout. But something's going wrong if people are shouting, right?
Rob K
Usually, it's a sign maybe people have lost control. Now that type of environment is almost gone. Yeah, it's very calm, focused environments, kitchens are now.
Mike Dowling
I guess a lot of it is. We now know that that chef isn't out in the kitchen preparing 700 meals. They've got a whole team. But early back in the day, people had the impression that if you messed up on a dish, that was the actual chef.
Mike Dowling
So it was their name that the dishes you were putting out was under their name. So I guess a lot of them were quite protective. Um,
Rob K
yeah, it's a and that's where the a lot of the frustration I imagine would come from chef patron You know, it's the names above the door Um, it's on you. It's on you. That's who they're going to come pointing it afterwards. Um, But yeah, there's certainly a team element to to delivering of anything just like in football, right?
Rob K
You know, it's not all on one person. It's not all on the striker. It's not all on the goalie, although maybe in a penalty situation it might not be on the goalie. But then, you know, then the training, you know, the stuff behind that, it's not just the onus of one person.
Rob K
Yeah, it's the same with the Chef Brigade, it's similar to a football team in that sense.
Mike Dowling
God, I didn't think of that, to be honest. I'm really annoyed now.
Rob K
But outside of football as well, it's the same in an office environment, any company structure. Yeah, you have the spearhead figure at the top, but everyone below that, everyone has to be doing their bit for it to work. So, yeah, look at a football club. If the person issuing and selling the tickets aren't doing their job.
Rob K
If the person picking up the rubbish at the end of the match isn't doing their job, then come the next match day, it's, you know, everything's not in line. So everyone's important, no matter if you're at the top or the bottom. It's like in the kitchen, if the person washing the dishes isn't, that's a hard job, you know, it's really, really hard. And it's so important to the kitchen, so important.
Rob K
And it's always overlooked.
Mike Dowling
dishes at home and that's hard enough, I'm not going to do 700.
Rob K
Yeah, everyone's important on a team, super important.
Mike Dowling
So you've been sort of travelled all over the world and you're working with different chefs all over the world. How did that kind of shape you and what lessons have you taken from that and the different cuisines? Is there anything you're in particular influenced by?
Rob K
It was an amazing experience. So traveling around with McLaren, Formula One team and sometimes Mercedes as well. It was an amazing experience, one that I never thought I would do. I didn't even comprehend that that role existed.
Rob K
you know, people think Formula One is in cars, mechanics, you know, engineers, but there's a, you know, this, these people need to be fed, a team needs to be fed, and yeah, so when I started working there, I was, I'd done a bit of traveling, but not to the extent that I experienced with Formula One, and As an individual, putting food to the side for a moment, as an individual you open your eyes to such a broad array of culture, lifestyle, way of life, climates, traffic, you know, all these things like the morning commute, everywhere, every big city has a morning rush hour and it's all, it all looks very different. And then everyone's food, how everyone eats, when they eat.
Rob K
You know, Middle East, in the Middle East, people go out a lot later because of the temperature. So that's probably why you see in London a lot of Middle Easterns out much later in the evening because they're used to it, that's their lifestyle. And yeah, I learned a lot of lessons whilst traveling. One, how to really dig in and work hard.
Rob K
I thought I'd worked hard before, but working on a Formula One team, you put in a shift and then if you're their lifeline in terms of food, so if the car goes wrong or has a crash and they need to work later and you need to do a dinner for a load of mechanics or load of engineers who are going to have to work an extra six hours, so you stick around and you do it for them because you know it's important. Again, if that person, that one cog doesn't do its job, the team doesn't work. So putting in an extra six hours or four hours at the end of a shift, you learn to adapt on the go.
Rob K
Maybe the supplier that you've ordered from has delivered substandard quality of produce. But because you're on the move, it's not like you have a long-standing relationship with a supplier. It's like a flash in the pan moment that you move on. Whereas like here in London, if my supplier sends me bad stuff, I'll send it straight back and it'll be replaced the following day.
Rob K
You don't necessarily have the time for that in these countries. So you have to be reactive as well, maybe some menu changes on the go. And so a lot in terms of being adaptable, working under pressure, working in a small team as well, working in a very small team, and what a small team can achieve when they're all driving in the right direction. Yeah, it was hard.
Rob K
It was fun times. It's a young man's game, I would say, but there are a lot of people in there who have been in there their entire lives and have done like 40, 50 years in Formula One. How their wives put up with it, I don't know, or their husbands put up with it, I don't know. But it's, I did it for seven years, so 20, sorry, 2009, 2016.
Rob K
And that was by the point where I was like, you know, you're living out of a suitcase. When you strip it all back, the glitz and the glam of Formula One, you strip it back, your airport, hotels, track, living out of a suitcase, changing time zones every week, jet lag, but going to work as well. the occasional party throw into the mix just to blow off some steam and have a few beers and have a bit of a party. Because you need to do that.
Rob K
I think everyone needs to have a few beers every now and again or sit and have a beer or relax. And yeah, it was good fun. A lot of lessons learned, a lot of fun had, and a lot of skills learned as well. Yeah, it was some good times.
Rob K
I miss them, but they sit there in memory proudly.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, it's when you're looking back, you know, I do miss those things. And you have to tell yourself, no, hang on, this is the other side of that coin that I don't miss. I miss, I've got the lovely rose-tinted spectacles to look on, but there's other things that went behind it.
Rob K
That's always the problem. So since leaving Formula 1, I've had job offers to go back into Formula 1. And it's like, oh, yeah, yeah, it'd be great. I can do this.
Rob K
And you just think, initially, your mind goes to the experience, the traveling, the, you know, doing all this. take a beat, take a breath and actually be like okay well hold on a minute, I'm doing 16-17 hour days, I'm not seeing my family as often, I miss out on the weddings and the birthdays etc. I don't see my friends and I'm exhausted by the end of it. So maybe not take it, maybe just go on holiday, scratch the itch for travel.
Mike Dowling
I was actually surprised, because when I was kind of asking about the experiences, I thought, I bet this is going to be an answer of, yeah, we go to the airport, we go to the hotel and the trailer, and then we go back to the hotel. We then
Rob K
go back to
Mike Dowling
the airports. We didn't see anything at all. But it's nice to know that you actually got to see various parts of the countries as well and experience them.
Rob K
Yeah, and our trailer, our catering trailer, only about two million pounds worth of one kitchen trailer that traveled everywhere with us. It was a pretty, pretty bougie kitchen to be racking up.
Mike Dowling
Are we going to see that? No. So there were different sort of people that you've mentioned, the mechanics, there was like bosses, sponsors, and the drivers as well?
Rob K
Yeah, so we look after drivers, team owners, shareholders, guests of as well so we'd have like lots of celebrities coming through as well um that are friends of say lewis hamilton just so the in my time being there we looked after uh we had lewis um we had jensen um who has to have stock of and on who Sergio Perez, or Checo as he's sort of more commonly known, Fernando Alonso, Kevin Magnusson, yeah, we experienced quite a few. It was, yeah, so you get the, I think the amazement with the celebrity-ism or like that sphere um you learn to shake it pretty quickly when you're there and just because because you get to work so closely with them you realize that they're just they're people doing a job doing the best what they want to do and and doing a very high level um and they just just don't like the harassment so if you just have a normal conversation It's like, I think it's like a breath of fresh air, because every other person that they
Rob K
meet between their own safe space in the motorhome and the team building to the car, it's just everyone, like, photos, autographs, all that kind of stuff. And that motorhome is like that safe space for them. That's their home, away from home, where they know the team, they know the chefs, we know their favorites, all that kind of stuff. And it's, yeah, so that was quite cool.
Rob K
That was quite cool to meet some other people like that.
Mike Dowling
So the main question there is, is Lewis as intense about his food as he seems about everything else?
Rob K
Just about onions. I'm not going to dive into his likes and dislikes. I know he's very much not a fan of onions. I believe he's now a vegan as well.
Rob K
He wasn't when I was there. I think he made the switch. A lot of people have made that switch in terms of lifestyle. So I went vegetarian for a year whilst working trackside.
Rob K
as a chef it was one of the hardest things to do when you're not exclusively cooking vegetarian or vegan food. But I was probably the best chef I'd ever been in and I felt good. It's a good, I think it's a good path. I'm not like a They give me a good steak to go, but I think it's a good way of life.
Rob K
But I know onions, because we could never make tomato sauce with onions for his pasta. So don't go chasing him with white onions down the street.
Mike Dowling
So you then have been working to sort of pressure situations and the food and putting out lots of food with different people, nutrition and all the rest of it, you then switched gears completely, that was a Formula 1 thing, switched gears. into becoming chocolate. Do you remember your thought process of how you went right I'm putting this to one side and I'm going to concentrate on chocolate and what kind of helped you make that decision?
Rob K
So it was a weird journey how I got there so in Montreal whilst on in my last year well I'd seen it a few years and I went there every year so the barring um who owned the baroni consort who owned 30 i think it was of macaron they would come to every race and they always wanted a nice dark chocolate or a nice selection of chocolates to have after their food or with tea or something and so we always go out and find some and in Montreal there's an amazing market called Atwater and they have all these artisan shops, fishmonger, butchers, veg store, dry goods, everything you could think of, bakers and they have this small chocolate shop and they weren't making their own but they just had like every bar from everywhere under the sun And so I just bought some. And I found it really cool how there could be so many different types of chocolate.
Rob K
I'd never really thought of it. I knew it existed, but I never really thought about it in that much depth. So I bought a couple, and I was like, this is amazing. Went from there.
Rob K
And then I decided to leave. I kept going back and forth from there anyway. And I started looking into it more and more and more. And I decided I wanted to leave Formula One.
Rob K
2016, end of 2016. I was like, what am I going to do? And when I stepped out, I was kind of having a bit of a break. And then I met up with a very long friend of mine.
Rob K
I've been friends with him since I first moved to London. And he said, look, we're starting this project with the Rothschild family. We're helping them this project. Do you want to get involved?
Rob K
It's for chocolate." And I was like, yeah, I'm there. That was the sign for me. I've been wanting to, I've been humming and aring about doing something. I was like, yeah, I want to get involved.
Rob K
So that was great. So did some product development with them and got a little bit of skills there. I also did a little bit of the sort of broader kitchen business elements of things and product costings and sort of a little bit more in depth. And from that, it was like, wow, this is like an amazing...
Rob K
People want to buy this amazing, like, creative chocolate that you can just make. Theirs was very traditional in style, and they wanted to keep it that way. I wanted to evolve the product range into a very modern style, like what I do now, where it's very colorful, it's very characterful. And they didn't want to do that.
Rob K
They wanted to keep to their traditional style, which is, you know, I get it. It's a traditional name, traditional brand style, I get it. So at that point, that was after two years of being with them. At that point, I decided to leave them.
Rob K
And I then randomly, I needed to make money to make a lot more money to be able to set up my own chocolate shop. Right. So I then went to Saudi, I disappeared to Saudi, took a shift job out there. I was back and forth between Saudi and the UK on and off for about a year and a half, about a year, sorry.
Rob K
And that's basically helped fund the start of XO. And yeah, then that kickstarted in early 2020 and then COVID happened.
Mike Dowling
That bit was missing from my notes. I was trying to line up all the dates and I was like, I've got some time missing here. I was thinking it doesn't work. So, yeah, 2020.
Mike Dowling
You decided you had enough money. You were all right. You'd be fine for a couple of years. And you did XO Chocolate.
Mike Dowling
First of all, what was the name?
Rob K
XO? Yeah.
Mike Dowling
You
Rob K
know, I was going around the house for so long on the name and Everywhere I looked, it was like, I don't know, insert name, Chocolate Company, established, I don't know, 2018 or whatever. And so I don't want my name above the door. I don't want it to be about me. It may be the product I'm making, but it's not about, and the reason why I'm doing it is not about me.
Rob K
It's about people. It's about, you know, that bringing together, like I mentioned earlier, the bringing together of people, the sharing, the emotive side of, of chocolate, which I think is overlooked a lot. And that's kind of why. So XO, I thought it was a bit cheesy at first, but then I was like, actually, no, it was like, more often than not, when you're gifting a box, it's like, you know, you're giving it for a gesture of love or friendship or, you know, we sign off
Rob K
our cards XO, be it for a loved one or someone that we're friends with or what have you. I sign off my emails to pretty much anyone to XO and I'm not talking a signature, I'm just like double check yours. I think it's for me that's the important side of Chocolate, it's building the connection helping people explore chocolate and get to know more about it and creating those moments that maybe I have or my staff will have in the shop across the counter where people are like oh this tastes amazing this is wonderful or you know hot chocolate on a winter's day it's like oh it's that warming feeling all those are little they're really like little love moments they're happy moments and so Yeah, I guess that's XO kind of happened into that and a little
Rob K
secret that I'll let you in on. I don't know how much coverage you get on this, so I don't know if I should say it or not. It's a personal thing for me. So XO, you've got for a numeral, you've got 10 for the X and O, so zero.
Rob K
So for me, it's a reminder to give 100% in Y2. But that's just for me, It's also like allowing people, it can be, you know, it means to me different to what it means to someone else. So if you're gifting a box to your wife or your friend, they're going to mean two different things. So it allows the gifter to make that choice.
Mike Dowling
I can't remember where the source I got this from, but the idea apparently was breaking the rules between sweet, savory, and tradition. What does that look
Rob K
like? I want to know where you got that from, too. I don't remember putting it out there, but someone might have done that in an interview. It's about using traditional application of chocolate, so the traditional methods that we do.
Rob K
Chocolate's a science, so we have to follow the rules. It's not like we can just throw something, we can throw a block of butter in and we can throw a bag of chocolate in and a jug of cream in. It doesn't work like that because everything would be out of balance potentially. So tradition is following traditional method and modern, the modern application in terms of its visual appearance and some of the flavor creations we make might not be traditional in style, might be a bit quirky, a bit unique.
Rob K
Popping candy, I don't think I did that a long time ago. And then savory, bringing savory elements to chocolate, it's so missed. So in 2023, I did a white truffle chocolate and won an international gold award. So, like, we're competing against, like, Harrods and stuff like that, and we beat them in our group, so...
Rob K
You wouldn't necessarily think to pair truffle with chocolate. It's mind-blowing. Truffle is a mushroom-type product. Mushroom with chocolate works just as well.
Rob K
It's sumac, a Turkish spice, a Middle Eastern spice, has... I use it in chicken. The players have it on their chicken sometimes. But it has a nice red, citrusy appearance and flavor.
Rob K
It works great in a caramel. What else have we got that I've done recently? It's saffron. Saffron's great in chocolate.
Rob K
Expensive. I don't do it too often. But trying to find savory ingredients that work with buckwheat. Buckwheat works with chocolate.
Rob K
There's so many different things you can do. Yes, it's a broad array of things that you do with chocolate. It's almost endless.
Mike Dowling
I've seen also your, it's sort of, the design site described as sort of a vibrant box of jewels, your chocolate, and your shops as stunning. I mean, how much is that part of the whole experience as well as the taste?
Rob K
So 100% it has to be 100% about the experience. So we as humans rely on our senses when we eat but also the environment in which we're eating in or being in will affect us on the day or the morning after. So we try and create these nice inviting spaces and I would with a little bit of modern elegance, I guess, but approachable. We don't want to block people away or create a space that's too intimidating or too unique that you ostracize certain groups of people.
Rob K
It's about making it nice, well-presented, simple, and just done well. Just doing things in a simple but effective and efficient way, an elegant way. It's It's a perfect recipe. And so it's super important.
Rob K
It's super important. The aesthetic of everything comes together. It marries with the chocolate. And also, there's something to be said that you could create a space that looks like an alleyway, trash cans, and all that kind of stuff, and have some artistic spin on it with chocolates.
Rob K
There's creative ways to do things like that, if you have a budget to do it. I don't. Yeah.
Mike Dowling
Well, you hinted at this, you kind of saved, you put the work in for that sort of year 18 months where you're going back and forth to Middle East, and
Rob K
you
Mike Dowling
opened your first store, boutique, not store, sorry, in Wimbledon. And you've also got one in central London as well. What has been the biggest hurdles, I'm guessing COVID's going to be mentioned in a minute, along the way, and sort of where was the point that you're thinking, if this is good, I've made the right decision here? Or have you reached that yet?
Rob K
I guess it's a daily question I ask myself. But some of the biggest hurdles were, yeah, sure, COVID, C word. That was a real shock. I didn't know what to do.
Rob K
That happened. And so I was like, OK, so I'll just close everything, follow suit. Because of the timing in which we set up our business, we weren't eligible for the government relief because it was something like three days, and so the local borough wouldn't release the money to us, and I had to go and basically send a letter to the local MP, being like, three days, we miss it, and everything's completely gone.
Rob K
I was like, some exceptions need to be made. This is a unique set of circumstances. And they were, in the end, supportive. So initially, we closed shop and followed suit of everyone else.
Rob K
I then disappeared back to Devon, probably shouldn't have done that given the lockdown rules. I just came back to Devon to look after and be with my parents. We've got a lot of space down there so I stayed in the outbuilding and just to be there then in case they needed me. I then start doing some maintenance work for my stepdad, helping him out and I end up having a a pole, a metal pole, go through my leg, which is shot out by a tree stump grinder.
Rob K
He had some tree stumps. I had the time. I was getting rid of them for him. And it shot through my leg and so severed all my leg muscle through the bone.
Rob K
Yeah, horrible. So I'm then laying in a field, this woodland, and an ambulance on the way. And I then spend the next three days, four days in hospital. couple of operations and my legs all strapped up, I'm in a boot, I couldn't move my foot because I'd severed all the muscles and then that was me in Devon for about three months, three and a half months, learning to walk on that foot again and then I
Rob K
came back, opened the shop on crutches and And I couldn't get physio, so I still couldn't move my foot at this point. I couldn't get physio. And then a big shout out to this guy. I've got a lot of love for this guy.
Rob K
He's the Harlequin's, or was, I don't know if he still is, the Harlequin's physio. He came into the shop because we could do one in, one out, get a coffee, a couple of chocolates. And he lived on the end of the road, and he gave me a, he's like, come over, give you a free physio. And he hooked machines up to my legs, got my foot moving in within a couple of days.
Rob K
And walking by, I don't know, within seven days, almost a full range of movement in my foot. It was incredible. So that was the biggest challenge. And then, I guess from then on, the challenge is understanding business, really, and making mistakes along the way.
Rob K
selling the product too cheap, selling the product too high, not getting the business, those types of things. Dealing with plumbing issues, dealing with electrical issues, all those types of things that you suddenly have to wear the hat for. Yeah, those are some quite challenging times. And then getting the second shot.
Rob K
You know, you think people probably think you do one, it's going to be easy just to do the second, but it's the hardest step. It's the hardest step. um yeah so some really challenging times um and then we got to a stable point uh in and amongst the middle of that where um we're doing really well and we have good stock laid down um we've got a long shelf life on our products and I have all this time and then enter such a united
Mike Dowling
That's exactly the next question. How did that kind of come about? I was expecting when you started saying a physio came into your shop, I was like, oh no, was that Kat? Was that Bobby?
Mike Dowling
How did that happen?
Rob K
Although Kat, I hurt my shoulder when we were putting in the new hospitality unit. Kat had to give me some physio, bless her. Big shout out to Kat. And Paul and all the other guys and the interns there put my shoulder right in a couple of days.
Rob K
So big shout out to them, big love. Yes, so someone at the club approached me and was like, hey, team need a chef to support them on a nutritional basis, someone who's worked with athletes and stuff like that before. And so I was like, I mean, yeah, cool. I mean, how many days a week?
Rob K
What's the deal? And I went over to Harlington. I met with Matt Gray. Sean and just had a chat.
Rob K
I was like, what are you guys looking for? How can I help? What are you getting at the moment? Where do you want to be?
Rob K
And it kind of worked from there really. It was like one, it was like two days a week initially. And then they're like, I don't know, we want to end up getting to four. And then as they got, the guys are going through the season and getting more stuck in.
Rob K
And then it was three days, then it was four. And it was kind of like that for, yeah, for like a season. And I then initially split the role down with a colleague of mine who works at a freelance base with me. And we've worked in Saudi together for years.
Rob K
We've known each other for about eight years. And yeah, it went from there, really. And that was three years ago now, I think, 2021. Mid-2021, I think, it was when I sort of stepped in and started helping out.
Mike Dowling
Did you know of Sutton beforehand, or was this just a... I
Rob K
didn't know of football before. Before 2020, I wasn't a football person, really, to be honest with you. Yeah, I didn't know of Sutton. I didn't know of, I don't know, Brentford.
Rob K
I didn't know of... Brighton and Hove Albion, or if that's what they're called. Yeah, I'm still learning about football now. But I understood the fuel that people needed to work at optimum.
Rob K
And so when, yeah, so like meeting the players and stuff like that on that first year was great. They were really welcoming, really lovely. But they were like, yeah, I'm the number nine, whatever. And I'm like, cool, what does that mean?
Rob K
It's like, yeah, brilliant. That's wicked, mate. Move along. Someone waiting for you.
Rob K
Yeah, yeah, and they, you know, they tell me they say all kinds of things like, I can't even name to now their position or they did. So I asked questions like, what does your role do? What's your What's your purpose on the team? Like, not in a condescending way, but, you know, trying to
Mike Dowling
understand. Rob sits in the kitchen going, what's
Rob K
the point of you? Now I have a much better understanding.
Mike Dowling
So who's, who would you say is the fussiest eater and why is it Jack Sims?
Rob K
Why is it Jack? Jack Simms is not not the fussiest eater. I was at the
Mike Dowling
player award and literally every dish that was coming out he's going ask Rob what this is and I'm like Jack it's chicken. You can see it's chicken what's wrong with you? So
Rob K
that's the thing I don't think he's a fussy eater, I think he's a naive eater and he doesn't know what he's eating. No, he's always a good good guy. He's, he has some things intellectually, he's a good one, well they're all great guys. And he's really easy to talk to and get along with.
Rob K
Who's the fussiest eater? Nads. Nads is her. Nads and the gaffer.
Rob K
Nads and the gaffer. Yeah. Do you know what? A lot of the guys would...
Rob K
I did a questionnaire for them at the beginning of the year. Did every year. New players. Understand their likes, dislikes, allergies.
Rob K
Go through all that. And just capture that information to begin with. Then you can rule out a lot of things, like pork. don't do a lot of the guys don't eat it not for religious purposes but just as they don't they don't want to eat it and that's fine so we just don't we don't have it um and no one misses it so it's great um and um yeah Nads
Rob K
and Gath are definitely the fussiest eaters yeah it's How easy I got to that decision.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, saying the gaff was a nice easy one.
Rob K
Easy one, but it was a fussy one.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, so you then kind of, you stayed in that role, you've enjoyed that role and now you're like, you know what, let's pile on a little bit more pressure and you're doing the match day food for both inside hospitality and the outside catering. what again how did that come about and what was your thought process for time but going yeah all right i can i can take that on
Rob K
um the thought process at the time so it they were i think they were going through the mechanics anyway i didn't i certainly didn't like jump to it and like run to it at all they um uh it was it kind of came from a discussion and they i think they were going to part with They'd already planned to part with the previous caterers. I think that kind of decision was probably made maybe some point when I stood in Harlington, I don't know. I think the new owners maybe wanted to change it up a bit.
Rob K
And so, yeah, we sat and had a conversation and they're like, do you want to take a shot at it? it wasn't as easy as that we went through the process as did we were competing against other companies as well so it wasn't just a here you go run with it type thing we had to work together um and we've it's great that we've built our relationship with you know from where we started to where we are now um it's been a oh i'm just Also, Wendy, the previous caterer who's just left, she's an absolute hero. She's amazing.
Rob K
And there was a crossover time with us both working there. And I think that could have been a rescue for disaster in most places, but she actually made the entire process very, very pain-free. And she's great. I was always offering her advice to the very last day.
Rob K
And I'm actually seeing her, I think, next week. I spoke to her on the phone two days ago, yeah, just for a catch-up and just to see how she's going. and she's got some bits to collect as well but no we're going to have a cup of tea together. So it was the outside that's a completely different operation, right?
Rob K
So some investment into getting that done and upping the offer. I saw what was on offer, I experienced what was on offer from both hospitality and fan food. And, you know, just really just pulling it into 2025. More menu offerings, we've got like chicken tenders on there, loaded fries, burgers with like brioche buns.
Rob K
Burgers are made by a butcher. We put an order in, three days, they're made and they're delivered. So we're getting fresh burgers every week. It's incredible.
Rob K
From where it's gone to where it is now, it's phenomenal. Yeah, we've got some vegan options, more vegan options and veggie options coming as well. And we've got mac and cheese, pops of mac and cheese on offer, which I think is a great absolute bargain. And it's proving to be a hit, you know, adding variety in there.
Rob K
So you can come one week and you can have a cheeseburger, a double cheeseburger. And you can come back the next week and you can have loaded fries or you can have the chicken tenders. So there's reason to keep coming back for the food. And with the hospitality, it's the same thing.
Rob K
We need to pull that into 2025. But also, I was very conscious and sensitive to what's been there for so long to not go too wild. Some people think I have already. I haven't.
Rob K
I'm just modernizing it. And we've got some great offers for midweek games as well. Sort of like classic dishes and some more sort of refined stuff on the weekend. But with any change like that, there's a small price adjustment as well.
Rob K
We are using like our fish is delivered fresh the morning of the event. And that's like fresh from a fishmonger. Same with the meat. So I've just placed the order this evening before this for our chicken that will arrive for our dish on Saturday.
Rob K
it's getting fresh, as fresh as we could possibly be. And that's so you're going to be a little bit of a price increase with that. And there is, and we understand it's not a good time to put prices up. But it is, is great.
Rob K
It's a great deal. It's a, you know, no one's, no one's raking it in from this. But three courses, three courses for I think it's 38 or 40 pounds. It's great.
Rob K
I've got some of my amazing chocolate there as well.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, oh, well, we'll come to that. But you've mentioned a new sort of style of matchday food. I mean, how... You're coming in with sort of fresh eyes, as you said, you haven't really done the football thing, so you're not kind of stuck in pie and chips, pie and pine.
Mike Dowling
So how much have you looked into this and how willing are you to experiment, to dip your toe in and see what happens, see what people like?
Rob K
We're already experimenting. So I'm collecting data every single match to know what works and what doesn't. So what we have, though, is not set in stone. I already have on the note of seeing what everyone else is doing.
Rob K
So the pie and mash type thing. I don't know if that was a pun or not, but that's actually happening. So for autumn, we have pies. It's the grand reveal.
Rob K
There's no surprise there. Pies for autumn. We're waiting for the winter. What we've got at the moment is very summery.
Rob K
A lot of it will stay. But yeah, pie is coming in autumn. And we'll probably put on a soup as well. We know a lot of people are asking for bovril.
Rob K
That's something I've learned. Why haven't you got bovril? I was like, what? Like, bovril?
Rob K
Yeah, bovril. I was like, you want to drink a cup of bovril? Like, yes. It's a genuine conversation.
Rob K
And I was like, is that a thing still? And he went, yeah, yeah, you got to get it. I was like, I'll get it. So that was ordered yesterday and it will be at the grounds tomorrow, ready for the weekend.
Rob K
So buffer on tap. Excellent. So we're learning, we're collecting data to learn from and adjust. Yeah so probably add a soup on in winter as well because I think it'll be really good pitch side and hopefully it's not pleasant to stand in the rain in the cold watching Sutton win but you know if a cup of soup, a really nice hearty cup of
Rob K
soup can do that and help that experience along then hopefully that'll keep fans pitch side. I almost said track side then, pitch side.
Mike Dowling
So you've mentioned some of the feedback. Has there been any unexpected or, apart from Bovril, any sort of unexpected or funny kind of like,
Rob K
what? Nothing that I've been shown. Nothing that I've been shown. I think, I won't repeat what I have seen on the, I think the first day it was released, I think a lot of people were price
Mike Dowling
conscious. Don't read socials.
Rob K
I don't, I don't, I'm barely on it, I'm barely, my face isn't on any of our social media and stuff like that, so I'm just not, I'm not that integrated into it. But one of the guys at the club showed me a post they did for us, and the first thing was about prices, and I get it, that's gonna happen, but I think, I think you can look at price, but you should also look at value. So if there's value in what you're paying for, then the price, if you're being, if you're overcharged for a really poor product, then yeah, then there's reason to complain about price. But I think the value of the product, the quality of the product and the price, I think line up very well.
Rob K
But apart from that, no. Have you got any
Mike Dowling
No, no, no, I love, all the ones I've had I've really liked.
Rob K
Oh no, maybe you've collected some from, I thought you might, I thought you might want to show me. Oh my
Mike Dowling
god, really, I'll do that. Well, I've got some things to tell you.
Rob K
I hear there's a Sutton forum, I haven't delved into that. Maybe, maybe there's some, maybe there's some things on there that lurking for me.
Mike Dowling
There was the, the uplifting price, but then A lot
Rob K
of
Mike Dowling
people said, yeah, but then the uplifting quality is higher than the uplifting price, so it's along the same lines. But I haven't, whilst I was at the Player Awards, and another one that you did, I haven't actually done the hospitality yet, so I'm doing it at the weekend. So firstly, what's on the menu? I heard chicken.
Rob K
There's chicken on the menu. You've got... Yeah,
Mike Dowling
I'll put you on the spot there.
Rob K
No, you haven't put me on the spot, but I just want to say it's on the menu. So it's kind of similar to what you've experienced at the awards. It's slightly different. There's a mushroom sauce involved.
Rob K
There's some really nice seasonal veg. And you've got chocolate mousse, you've got cherry gel, you've got macerated cherries, you've got, what else have you got in there? Yeah, you've got loads, there's a real rich dessert and chocolates at the end, obviously. And so chocolate with chocolate.
Rob K
We did a lemon tart last week. Sorry, the lemon tart last week. That was great. And yeah, there's, we've got six different menus.
Rob K
No, sorry, that's a lie. We have more than that. We have 10. So we have six Saturday menus and four midweek menus that we rotate through.
Rob K
so we can give lots of variety. So if you, let's say you went to last week's game on Saturday, coming to this Saturday you wouldn't experience the same food. So it's giving something that always something new, something new to explore, and we would love feedback. I asked for feedback from some people last week, some were very amazing and gave some, and it was stellar, they said.
Rob K
They really enjoyed it, thoroughly enjoyed it. There's a new team front of house as well. Colin, who's joined us a couple of weeks back, he's got... I was amazed when I saw his CV.
Rob K
So I called him, I was like, do you want to come in tomorrow for an interview? He said, yeah, he's got such a he served the queen he's served like huge financiers in the city on like director level like top floor skyscraper director boxes um he's like he's going to such prestigious events for prestigious people i was like oh wow this is great yeah come on come on in We'll try and find space for you. So he did his first Saturday event last Saturday and smashed it, did great.
Rob K
And he'll only get better with more time in the place.
Mike Dowling
Especially when he gets to know people as well, because he'll recognize people.
Rob K
Exactly, yeah. So spread the word, yeah, spread the word. No,
Mike Dowling
actually, this is where I was going to say, this is the plug time, and you've covered a lot of it. But if anyone hasn't tried it yet, how would you encourage them to give it a go?
Rob K
I think the best way, the most efficient and effective way to give it a go is a raffle. So we sat and we put our heads together a couple of weeks ago and we're like, how can we, because not every fan in the stadium is going to have the means to it's the same any football club you don't have the means um to go and spend 40 quid saturday afternoon plus your ticket plus your beer um speaking off um and um they're not going to have the means to do so so i was like let's run a raffle i mean community football there's raffles there's a raffle in the hospitality that goes on uh i think i raised a good amount of money last week but we came up with the idea of If you see people wandering around, buy a strip of raffle tickets.
Rob K
It's going to be five quid. Don't come out. I think it's five pounds for a strip of tickets, or maybe eight. But that's a real great way to get in there.
Rob K
And I'm not sure how many seats they're offering. I think the more people buy it, the more they're going to offer, I think, maybe. I don't know. I think it starts at two people.
Rob K
um to go um or one person sorry two people plus their ones i think it's the right thing but um yeah max has got all the information about the club max is doing a stellar job over there um and i think they're selling them in the club shop as well um yeah but um but yeah there's um that's a great way i think to get in there and experience it if you you know if you can't um if you don't have the cash to be able to do so because i i get it it's not Or save it for a special event. It's a special occasion.
Rob K
That's great. A birthday anniversary. And let us know in advance if that is the case. And we could do something special, birthday cake, surprise, or something like that.
Rob K
There's so many things.
Mike Dowling
many things and you didn't mention the wonderful interviews that go on while everyone's eating. It's okay, it's fine, it's fine, I'll let that
Rob K
go. I'm trying to keep everything on board in the kitchen. You're in
Mike Dowling
the kitchen, you didn't know the morons standing on stage, it's fine. Right, you'll be pleased to know we're wrapping up. This is the silly business question. So there's two of them.
Mike Dowling
Five years, we're sitting down to have another chat. What are your longer term hopes? Where would you like us to be food hospitality wise in five years? I
Rob K
think the I think that capacity and I think with a new look in that event space needs a little bit of a, a little bit of love, but I think that comes with cost and it has to be warranted as well. We have to get to capacity first. We're doing some improvements as we go as I'm personally doing that for the, helping with the club do that as well. For the kitchen also.
Rob K
And back up a couple of leagues. Back up a league. And having that strong foundation, you need that strong foundation there to make those improvements. But I'd love to see the club, that aspect of the club to be flourishing, you know.
Rob K
An extra stand, an extra 2,000 people match day? Yes.
Mike Dowling
You can take it, you can talk. Right, I asked Aaron Jones this question, so if anyone's not seen that interview yet, here's your plug, go and watch that one. He also balances two different careers. I know yours is a similar career, but it's two different things, and I'll tell you his answer, but what's your advice to anyone who's trying to juggle two different careers?
Rob K
Don't sacrifice everything. In the sense of time, make sure you have time. I fall foul of that all the time, and sometimes neglect other things. Really managing your time and knowing when to say, OK, enough.
Rob K
Because I think as an entrepreneur, as your own business, it's quite easy to keep saying yes to things. And I think you know when enough's enough. Not enough's enough, but just pump the brakes a little bit. Regain control.
Rob K
Yeah, take it for a bit and then go again. Reset, go again. And allowing yourself that break, that's definitely key. Keep hydrated as well.
Rob K
And don't stare at your computer until midnight. You know, you'll be better in the morning. I've done that so many times, just like working until the wee hours. then wake up just feeling exhausted.
Rob K
Just, you know, set yourself up a list, set yourself a time frame and stick to it and make mistakes early on as well and don't lose too much money in the process and then recover it.
Mike Dowling
your first word that you started that with was Aaron's advice, and it was don't. Just do one thing, stick with it, be good at it, and do one. So that's why I was laughing when you said don't. I was like, come on, you can't be giving that.
Mike Dowling
I
Rob K
think there are things, I think back when I was growing up as well, I was like, oh, I don't want to do the nine to five. Actually, the nine to five is perfectly structured, you know. you get those two days off, you can take your leave, you can switch off and shut down. It's your own business, you can't, you have to sacrifice so much.
Rob K
So yeah, don't is one thing, but also do. If you want to, do it. Do it with someone who's done it before or surround yourself with people who have experience. Definitely surround yourself with people who have experience and make, yeah, make the mistakes early on enough to be able to keep going.
Rob K
Yeah, but do, but don't.
Mike Dowling
Excellent. Well, that's going to wrap up this episode of Sutton Podcast. As always, we appreciate everyone's attention and feedback. Follow, like and share the episode at Sutton Podcast on all social medias and subscribe.
Mike Dowling
Give us a review on any of them as well. Give us the thumbs up on YouTube. You
Rob K
know I
Mike Dowling
love the thumbs up on YouTube. Big thank you to Rob. I'm very much looking forward to the food on Saturday. So I'll be doing the two.
Mike Dowling
I'll be doing the food, then jumping up and doing a little interview and then jumping back down for my food. So I'm very much looking forward to that. And also when you're going to XO online, don't forget to put the code Sutton Podcast in. It won't do anything at all, but I like telling you to do that just because I think it's funny.
Mike Dowling
And thanks everyone for listening. Hope you enjoyed this episode of Sutton Podcast. Take care and we will catch up soon. Bye bye.
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