Hello and welcome to another episode of Sutton United Talk Time on Podcast, in association with Lucky Star Gin! I’m your host, Mike, and the fantastic Andy and Mark join me to dissect the thrilling, frustrating, and ultimately dramatic 3-3 draw with Hartlepool United.
The atmosphere at the VBS Community Stadium was buzzing for the late kick-off, but the result left us with the familiar feeling of an emotional rollercoaster. The big question looming over the Gander Green Lane faithful: Are these late goals and draws a sign of a massive confidence shift, or just papering over some deep defensive cracks?
Mike Dowling
Hello and welcome to another episode of Sutton United Talk Time on podcast. It's the Sutton podcast in association with Lucky Star Gifts. I'm your host, Mike. If you're a regular listener, as always, thank you for coming back.
Mike Dowling
I've spoken to a few people and I really do genuinely, genuinely like everyone listening. really appreciate it all. If you're a new listener, hello. Today we have Andy and Mark and I'm going to just mention one little quick thing because while I'm talking about new listeners, I have found out that we do have a new regular listener and it's Aggie's mum.
Mike Dowling
So, hello,
Speaker 4
Tina, and behave yourselves.
Mike Dowling
He told me yesterday, I was like, oh, okay. We do love hearing from everyone. Join the conversation, stay connected, share your thoughts on the episodes and chat amongst yourselves, but give us those likes and thumbs up and boost the algorithm and all the rest of it.
Mark
I don't get
Mike Dowling
nothing out of it other than an ego boost, so don't worry, you're not lining my pockets. Mark, how are you?
Mark
Yeah, I just about recovered from yesterday's result. These old kick-off times do throw me, though. You're used to 3 o'clock on a Saturday when it's either 12.30 or 5.30. It just throws you out, doesn't it?
Mark
Your normal rhythm is gone. So I have a bit of adjustment to do, but I don't think I'm the only one who found that a bit odd.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, of the two, I prefer the 12.30. It's odd, but I still prefer the 12.30, because I was at football only a couple of hours after kickoff. And Sally's messaging, how long are you going to be? And I'm like, she messaged me already, because I realized it was nearly 10 o'clock at night.
Mike Dowling
I'm like, whoa, OK, I need to shift myself home. Andy, how are yourself?
Andy
Yeah, I'm good, I'm good. I quite enjoyed the 5.30 kickoff to be honest with you. Thank you. I don't know, I don't, I don't know the attendance.
Andy
I almost about didn't remember to look, but it felt quite busy and particularly, yeah, particularly the bars to queue for a drink was, was maybe longer than normal. So that's maybe a good sign that we had a better attendance. And yeah, I thought it was quite, I quite enjoyed the later kickoff.
Mike Dowling
I promised Lottie I wouldn't be moaning about this, but I hope you weren't one of the people that were moaning about the queues, because on Tuesday, they obviously didn't have as much staff, because it was all last minute, and some of the bars were closed, and I had people moaning at the bar staff that they show short staff. fairly sure they know they're short-staffed. I'm pretty confident the ones actually here working are aware of the situation.
Andy
To be fair, I think they move pretty quickly. I used one in the fan zone. They move pretty quickly. I think it was nice to see that there was plenty of people in the ground before the game.
Mike Dowling
As people often say, nice problems to have.
Andy
Solve
Mike Dowling
them. The more people spending money, the more we can spend as well. Right, we have... Lucy keeps telling me off because I don't pay as much attention as I could to the ladies side, but literally they're ending the match a little bit before I'm about to record.
Mike Dowling
But they won away at Barking 2-1 and they are on a really good run. She did tell me they're unbeaten in several games of Excitement 7. So, really, really well done to the ladies and they worked really hard today. Her interview was saying it was a difficult game and they had to work hard.
Mike Dowling
So, well done to them and again, David Weir, so get along and watch them whenever you can. It's a good experience and they're playing really nice football at the moment. Mark, we're going to start with you. The expectations before the game, line up any kind of surprises for you over and above the return of Hayden, but how were you feeling going into it and was the lineup pretty much as you thought?
Mark
I was fairly optimistic about this one. I thought we had a good chance of winning. Hartlepool were a bit out of sorts. They've just departed company with their manager.
Mark
Their recent form has not been great, probably a bit better than ours, but not great. And I thought, you know, playing under the lights might give us a bit of a boost. So I was cautiously optimistic about this one. As for the line-up, yeah, Hayden Muller had been recalled, as we knew.
Mark
I wasn't expecting him to go straight into the starting 11. And when I saw the line-up, I thought, ooh, there'd be four centre-backs there. How's that going to work out? And of course, Hayden was deployed as a sort of holding or defensive midfielder.
Mark
alongside Jack Wadham. So that was a little bit of a surprise. Other than that, I think the starting 11 was pretty much as expected.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, I think, well, I'm sure in one of the pre-match one, he'd said, Hayden is probably one of our best midfielders. What's he doing out on loan? And I was like, Andy, what about yourself? What were your expectations?
Mike Dowling
What did you think of the
Andy
line-up? Yeah, I was quite optimistic going into the game. I think, as Mark says, it helped that Harneypool weren't on form. Particularly getting two late goals in the two cup games, sometimes it can change the mood and the momentum.
Andy
Even though they're games on paper we should be winning maybe more comfortably. Sometimes you need that kind of catalyst to spark some sort of change in fortune or form. So yeah, I was quite optimistic based on that going into the game. And I guess the team, yeah it was quite, as you said, straight back in.
Andy
That was somewhat of a surprise. But I think outside of that, I think the line-up's been quite settled since the new manager came in, so yeah, I think it was as expected really.
Mike Dowling
So one kind of question we were asking the other week was, well, has Brandon deserved a starting place? And he did start on Tuesday. Or is it he's a real impact coming off the bench, a real handful? And I think we may have had a hint of what Chris
Speaker 1
is
Mike Dowling
feeling. Do either of you think that that could be switched, the Brandon Nadas situation? Or are you happy with how it's going at the moment with Brandon Nadas doing the running and then Brandon coming on a little bit later. Mark.
Mark
I think we do need another striker. I think we're a bit too dependent on those two. And if one of them is missing for whatever reason, you know, you really are short up front. Nader's works hard, does a lot of running.
Mark
He's not a kind of natural finisher in the way that, say, Will Davis is. and he needs a bit more support, I think. And I think you're right, I think Brandon is more of an impact player when he's come on as a sub, as he did yesterday. He tends to score, whereas I haven't analysed this, but I get the impression when he starts, he doesn't tend to score as often or as many goals.
Mark
But I think getting another striker in, if we can, is got to be something of a priority. Obviously, there are defensive issues to sort out as well. So it's difficult to know where to start when you're talking about improving or strengthening the side. But yeah, I think we do need another striker to be really effective at this level.
Mike Dowling
And Andy, I mean, it must be a difficult situation for Brandon, because obviously every player wants to play. And when you come off and you score these goals, you make these changes, you have the impact, and you're back at the same role, you might
Speaker 1
be
Mike Dowling
thinking, oh, maybe I shouldn't do so well off the bench. I don't want to start. But it is a really good thing, is where he's coming on against tired legs, and he's having this great impact. But would you switch it up, if it were you?
Mike Dowling
Are you happy with it?
Andy
Obviously, none of us make the choices
Mike Dowling
anyway, because it doesn't matter.
Andy
I'll be honest, I'd like to see him get more minutes, just in general. I think he's been one of the better players for this season. The funny thing is, I was thinking of this yesterday. I'm not sure I've seen him on the pitch.
Andy
I might be wrong. I haven't been to every game, but it doesn't feel like he's on the pitch that much with David or Bonner. It kind of feels like it's always one or the other. And for me, they're possibly, what I would say, our biggest weapons this season.
Andy
I do think they've been two of the key attackers, two of the more dangerous attackers. Maybe not always that consistent, but between the two of them, I just don't feel like I've seen them on the pitch together that much. And I think, well, if they're your most dangerous players, you probably should play them.
Mike Dowling
So someone good would have those stats at their fingertips to be able to go, well, this, but no, you're not gonna get that here. I do like the way you said that David and Brandon are our biggest threats. They're not, they're not the tallest threats. But whilst a lot of people can come away with a regret from a draw, obviously, Mike's version of events is we are unbeaten still under the new manager.
Mike Dowling
Do you think that's important? Even though we're not getting the wins, Andy, do you think it's important to keep getting the draws? And, I mean, you've mentioned the late goals. It was going against us not that long ago and now we're scoring our late goals.
Mike Dowling
That must have a big impact.
Andy
I think it's really important, yeah. I don't know if you remember Jürgen Klopp. When he started at Liverpool, and they had a random like 2-2 draw home to West Rum I'm sure. And at the end of the game, and I'm sure they scored like a late equaliser, and I'm sure at the end of the game, he got the players over to the Kop and made the link hands and the bow type action.
Andy
And people were maybe deriding him a bit. Like, why are you celebrating this? It's 2-1 against West Brom. You should be winning it on paper anyway.
Andy
But as I said, I think what he was doing was actually saying, look, even though on paper you should win the game, actually getting these late goals and turning results into something which A game you were losing, to get something out of the game is important, just to kind of change the confidence and the momentum. I think it's massive that we're actually scoring those goals and actually coming away from games which, going into the 90th minute, we were losing and coming away with something. I think it's massive.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, it's definitely a different feeling, isn't it, Mark, where you're losing the game and then you get away with a draw than winning the game and getting pegged back to a draw. It's a definite feeling around the club. But how important do you feel it is just to keep building the run, the momentum and turning the losses into draws and the draws into wins?
Mark
Yeah, we've been relying on very late goals in the last three games, helping me to either get a draw or win. But that's evidence that the players keep going. They go right through to the final minute of the game, looking for that crucial goal. And if you carry on doing that, then you do sometimes get your reward.
Mark
And we've seen that. That said, you know, I still think we need to be winning games more cleanly, more clearly, getting the winner earlier in the game, not having to rely so much on stoppage time, winners or equalizers to get the results that we need. So, you know, it's great that we've got this little unbeaten run now of four games, three draws and one win in the cup. But we need to start turning these draws into wins and losses into draws.
Mark
We can't keep on with 3-4 draws or 3-4 defeats or whatever. That's not going to get up the table. We need to get wins. We're in a situation now where even if we win our next game, we're still going to be in the relegation zone.
Mark
That's a really bad place to be.
Mike Dowling
But on the late goal, Eden seemed to really enjoy it. I didn't realise he played for Hartlepool previously.
Mark
I also didn't
Mike Dowling
realise that Topalovic was at Hartlepool until someone had mentioned it. I know George is there, but I didn't realise that Topalovic was there. He had a lot of adrenaline, whether that was because he'd scored a last-minute goal or against his former club, I don't know. another set-piece goal.
Mike Dowling
It was an incredible moment, but do you think he went a little bit over the top with the kicking of the flag? But yeah, I mean, how much is that going to mean to him? I mean, I think he's had a couple of goals, I think he's on two or three now. I
Mark
think so, three, yeah.
Mike Dowling
Yeah. How important is that for our centre-backs to be getting those goals, Mark?
Mark
Yeah, I mean, Tissot scored a very late goal against Farnham, didn't he? I think Jack did get one early in the season, didn't he? I've got a recollection. So yeah, I mean, the centre-backs perhaps haven't been defending quite as well as we would like, but they've been scoring goals.
Mark
that's some compensation or consolation. But yeah, I don't know the circumstances under which Eden Pruty left Hartlepool, whether there's any sort of bad feeling lingering there, or whether it was just the fact that it was a late goal that felt like a winning goal, because we were heading for defeat and we managed to snatch a point from the jaws of defeat, and whether that was what was, you know, causing him to react in that slightly frenetic manner. Maybe we should ask him that.
Mark
Yeah, he obviously enjoyed that goal.
Mike Dowling
Obviously enjoyed that. Andy, I am more leaning towards the celebration side because it was he stayed at our end and was clearly happy to have scored. He wasn't kind of running off over to their fans. I presume it's going to be just over exuberance.
Mike Dowling
But what did you feel about the goal, the celebration?
Andy
Yeah, well, it's nice to see, it's nice to see that that much streamed, in my mind. Did he get, did he get any yellow card for it, or? He did like that.
Mike Dowling
Whether it was booting the ball, which someone said on Twitter, I saw he booted the ball into the crowd, someone could have got hurt, and I was like, no, if you watch that ball there, it's not going anywhere near the crowd, it's
Andy
gone into the railway station. That's the downside, because if that means at some point in the season he's suspended, that's not great. But no, it's nice to see it then that much. Set pieces are important.
Andy
At the start of football, we try to play like all teams do. You play from the back and you pass it out and the risk-reward. But the set-piece goals are still really important, as you can see from Arsenal in the Premier League. How few they concede and how many set-pieces they score.
Andy
you look where that's got them so it is good that we've got that those those options and the delivery was fantastic as soon as you put in you've got right there's a chance for it because um that yeah that's that's really important we'll start calling sims the post
Mike Dowling
that's too old-fashioned um defensively you both mentioned it and Hayden even mentioned it in his post-match which was interesting. So we took the lead twice but we were pegged back twice and then fell behind. Hayden described it as again Chris has been saying a lot about moments and he described it as moments of loss of concentration Now, Chris's post-match said these are things that can be worked on. These are all things that you can deal with.
Mike Dowling
How do you think we can deal with them? Because he did mention whether it's with coaching the current players or replacing the players. Andy, how do you feel about these defensive moments that are costing us important points?
Andy
I think it's probably a bit generous to call them moments because that suggests it's like an isolated, and it's not, because how many goals are we conceding at home? I think for Bournemouth, was it four Bournemouth? Three against someone else. And for defending for particularly, the first goal was a decent head up, right?
Andy
The second and third goal. Very similar. They're just long balls down there, right? And we switch off both times.
Andy
There wasn't particularly nothing clever about what they did. Just a long ball down the right channel. Yeah. And right.
Andy
We switch off. And particularly the third one. I think if you watch it, I think it's a free kick even. And we've got three players.
Andy
I think it's like Wadham, Jones, someone else who literally just switch off and the guy runs in behind him. And I think Wadham tried to get back, but it was too late. So, yeah, it's really poor and we can't afford to concede three goals at home every game. And I would say it's a lack of confidence and it's probably a bit of a lack of experience because there's a lot of young guys back there.
Andy
And I think perhaps we need maybe a more experienced centre-back or more experienced defender to help the younger players. I think once you've got a very young goalkeeper, young centre-backs, and the confidence is low, they're in the second bottom, I think it's going to be difficult with those players to kind of dig ourselves out of it unless we bring at least one more experienced player
Mike Dowling
in. Mark, how do you feel about the description of the ming moments? That
Mark
was also a term that Steve Morrison used describing games, post-match interviews. Yeah, I mean, you can play well for 89 and a half minutes and you just switch off once, it can cost you a slider goal. it's all about maintaining the right sort of focus right the way through the game from the first to the final whistle and that's hard you know it's very hard to concentrate for that length of time all the moments where you need to be really switched on and doing what you have to so it's understandable that players even at the top level you know do make mistakes from time to time they lose focus temporarily and that gives the opposition an opportunity maybe a goal You can you can work on a certain amount of training of course
Mark
and I'm sure Chris is focused on that but if particular players are consistently having these poor moments in games and you're not able to coach it out then you have to conclude that you know they're not quite good enough for this level of football. I think some of our fans have reached that conclusion already about some of our players. You're hearing there are five, six players in the squad who are just not good enough for this level. I
Mike Dowling
want to talk about one of the goals because David Desai came in for a bit of criticism for the second goal. What is he doing? Blah, blah, blah. I've watched it back a couple of times.
Mike Dowling
Yes, he came rushing out. But the guy could do that same thing a hundred times
Speaker 1
and
Mike Dowling
he would get it in once because he kind of, as David's rushed out, he's looped it up and it's gone
Speaker 1
right
Mike Dowling
over and settled nicely. And it's like, you're not going to do that again and again and again. So
Speaker 1
it
Mike Dowling
was a good, lucky finish in my opinion. I'm not sure what else Dave could have done, to be honest, because the defence had left him and there was not a lot of options. But what's your thoughts on that goal, Mark? feel that a more experienced keeper could have dealt with it differently, or is it just an unlucky moment?
Mark
I think there was a bit of miscommunication between David and his defenders, yes, you're right, so it wasn't entirely his fault, that goal, but the cardinal rule as your goalkeeper is you don't rush out for a ball unless you're sure you're going to get it, and he didn't. And there was a bit of a fluke, that goal, but, you know, there was always a risk. The guy loves you, it's going to go in. The guy himself, I don't think he expected it to end up in the net.
Mark
He was rather surprised to then be celebrating that goal. But yeah, if he stayed on his line, that goal probably wouldn't have happened.
Mike Dowling
Andy, what do you think? I think if he'd stayed on his line, it was probably more likely, simply because the guy had so many options. He tried to close him down, do all the right things, but it didn't work out. What are your thoughts?
Mike Dowling
You've got to choose now, haven't you? You've got to decide, am I going to agree with Mark or am I going to agree
Andy
with Mike? It was fair defended all round, without a doubt. I can't think it was, but it was fair defended all round. The centre-back had lost him.
Andy
I do agree with Mark. If he stays on his line, I don't think the goal is likely to happen. I know it was maybe an unusual finish. I don't know why he went for that, but by coming out and not getting the ball, you've always given the striker a very good chance.
Andy
Regardless of how he then takes it, it was a very strange finish. He has to get the ball or stay on his line. That's the long and short of it.
Mike Dowling
Right, we've lost Andy. Sorry, everyone. You disagreed with me. No, I'm joking.
Mike Dowling
You're still there. Don't worry. You've mentioned him already, Andy, Louis Simpa. He got man of the match again, which is obviously quite easy to give when we're doing well in games.
Mike Dowling
He scored a goal. He created a goal. No, I don't think it had anything to do with Brandon's goal. But anyway, he got at least one goal.
Mike Dowling
He did. You did? Okay, maybe go on to assist then. So,
Speaker 1
very easy
Mike Dowling
choice. He has started to play himself into form and as you mentioned, the set pieces have been really, really good. What do you think has been the change for him? Do you think it is literally the new manager bounce or has something else clicked for him?
Mike Dowling
Andy, that's you.
Andy
I don't know. I think he's been one of our better players this season, to be fair, even Under Steve Morrison, but yeah, it's definitely It's definitely started to click for him. And yeah, he was involved in the second goal. Although I think the actual assist was from their player And if you watch it that it's a it's a lovely way to go But yeah, yes, it's it's good to see you know, it's maybe maybe that's why we're getting goals from Yeah, from all positions.
Andy
And Simpa is definitely in there in terms of his contribution. And that's maybe because the forwards, although they're not scoring, are creating the spaces for other players, which isn't how we played last year. It was very much Rory Davies scoring most high percentage of our goals, particularly after Christmas. This year, it's gone the exact opposite way.
Andy
So, yeah, as I said, I think there may be some credit to the forwards as well for for creating the spaces for midfielders or other players to really take advantage of.
Mike Dowling
Mark, what do you think? Do you think Zim's form has improved or is it just the team has improved and therefore he's getting the rewards?
Mark
Yeah, I agree with Andy. He's been one of our better players this season, but I think he has stepped up a bit since Riz Agata arrived. I mean, he was involved in all three of our goals and he scored the first one, of course. The second one, it was a kind of long, bursting run into the opposition half, shrugged off a couple of defenders.
Mark
And although he did lose the ball, their guy got
Speaker 4
it
Mark
a loose pass, which Brandon read, and he managed to get the ball and go on and score. And then, of course, Lewis put in the corner for the third goal. So, that man of the match award was well deserved.
Mike Dowling
And on the set pieces, which I know you've both mentioned, Do you feel we're stronger, we're getting the reward than this year? Do you feel that we're doing well defensively against them or are we on a nice little balance? Again, I haven't got these, I'll forward the question, but I haven't got any stats to go either way, but what's your gut feeling, Mark? Do you feel like we're about even with our attack and defending on set pieces or are we ahead or behind?
Mark
We seem to be scoring quite a few goals from corners. I forgot to mention Harry Phipps, of course, another centre-back, scored at Thornham. Yes, that's true. But, yeah, I think if he'd been playing at centre back, he'd have gone up for that corner.
Mark
So, yeah, we seem to be doing quite well from corners this season. Not quite sure about free kicks, though. Maybe not quite so good on those. But, you know, I think our set-piece performance is perhaps edging in the right direction this season.
Mike Dowling
Andy, yourself, how do you feel about the set pieces attacking, defending?
Andy
Yeah, I've not really thought about how many we've conceded from set pieces. It doesn't feel like many. Yeah, but we've conceded a lot of goals, haven't we? But I don't feel like there's a high proportion of them from set pieces.
Andy
But yeah, it's going well. um in in terms of attacking set pieces um but yeah it's kind of the rest of the defending we need to sort out i would say
Mike Dowling
fair enough um i didn't actually write down the crowd but it was a good sized crowd i know people often have different views on the announced crowd but it's always tickets sold whether season tickets
Speaker 1
turn
Mike Dowling
off or not it's not relevant but was a good-sized crowd. It felt fairly big. Andy, you've mentioned the 5.30 kickoff. Do you feel that had an influence on the crowd?
Mike Dowling
Because some people would have gone to other games and maybe shot over to ours. And what was the atmosphere like for you?
Andy
Yeah, I think maybe it did help. I think maybe people would kind of watch the early kick-off or I'd watch the games at 3 o'clock and then managed to get to 7. So yeah, it did feel like a good crowd, good atmosphere. Yeah, I quite enjoyed the 5.30
Mike Dowling
kick-off. I mean, it might be a bit too early to say this, but do you think that Aggie's constantly mentioning the crowd, constantly thanking everyone, do you think that is helping bring numbers down where people go,
Speaker 1
oh,
Mike Dowling
OK, you know what, I'm going to go down, I want to be part of this? Or is it too early to call that kind of thing?
Andy
I'd say possibly it's a bit early. You wonder how many kind of maybe casual fans who may go to these games are really just watching his interviews on YouTube. early to say that that's a factor. But yes, certainly, maybe the number of goals, which I think is quite strange, actually, because his first game was Brentry, wasn't it?
Andy
Which was a nil-nil, and it looked like we'd set up really defensively in that game. And you thought, right, he's just going to try and save a ship, try to stop the conceding goals. And then, obviously, the next three games have gone exactly the completely opposite way. But yet, you know, everyone would rather watch a three-all than a nil-nil.
Andy
And I'm sure that could help in terms of attendances.
Mike Dowling
And what about yourself, Mark? What do you feel about the attendance, the atmosphere and whether Aggie's thanking the fans has anything to do with
Mark
it? Yeah, I think it was about two and a half thousand, wasn't it? Which is, I think, a bit above average for this season at GGL. I mean, you know, Chris has been very positive in his interviews so far.
Mark
He says, thank the crowd. And I think that's quite a refreshing approach. And I think There'll be some fans who listen to those interviews and will give them the benefit of the doubt and say, yeah, I sense some new positivity here. I'm going to come to a game that I might otherwise not have bothered with.
Mark
I don't think he's going to attract too many of the kind of occasional fans, because they're probably not watching his interviews. But those fans who do listen to them, probably the regulars, I think are going to be to some extent encouraged by what he's been saying but of course the results have got to follow and ultimately a manager, head coach is judged on his results so if the results don't improve then you know I think some fans are going to start drifting away.
Mike Dowling
I mean on the atmosphere it was good and as always well played to the young'uns who were doing so much to try and push it but when that board went up with added time was a real, real buzz around the stadium. There was a whole like, right, okay, we're now going to score. So it's a very short term change that is, because normally it's like, oh God, hang on, we've got another eight minutes. But now it's like, right, here we go, we're gonna score at some point.
Mike Dowling
Did you guys feel that, or am I over romanticizing everything? Mark, what did you feel when that board
Mark
arrived? Yeah, I did sense that. I mean, I don't think many people were expecting eight minutes. You know, people were expecting maybe four minutes, which is usually pretty standard.
Mark
until recently anyway at this level, so when it was eight, you know, probably twice as long as most of us expected, that's enough time to score two goals, even more, and obviously we're just down by the one goal at that stage. and I think the players probably a little bit surprised that there was that much and it would have given our guys a little bit of a boost and of course the visitors were hanging on with that one goal lead and that probably had a slightly negative effect on them because I think we've got to hang on for four more minutes than we perhaps expected and the momentum then was I think with us and you know even so it wasn't until deep into those eight added minutes that we got that third goal. But, you know, as I said earlier, you think these guys played to the final whistle and, you know, we got the reward.
Mike Dowling
Andy, what did you think? Did you feel a buzz or a change in excitement when the board went up, the crowd kind of taking it in?
Andy
Yeah, because eight minutes, it does give you plenty of time, doesn't it? There is a big difference between a standard four and an eight. And when we scored late goals in the last two games, I think there was a real belief that we could get the equaliser. So yeah, I did feel that certainly maybe more than, you know, a game a month or two back when if there was injury time, I don't think anyone maybe was expecting anything then.
Andy
And I think maybe that the last two games have helped and, you know, hopefully going forward as well.
Mike Dowling
Yeah, I think possibly a month or two back, the eight minutes going up, we'd be like, as Mark just said, there's time for two goals. That means two more for them is what you'd be forcibly thinking. I mean, Andy, stick with you. Do you feel with this draw, it was two points lost or a point gained?
Mike Dowling
Now, going into the 90th minute, as you said, definitely you think it's a point gained, but on the match overall, do you feel like actually we should have put that to bed or is it about right?
Andy
Yeah, I think, I think we, I do actually think we were a better team. And I think it was a match we, we really, I think we deserved, definitely didn't deserve to lose. I think it was a match, it was definitely a winnable match. I mean, that way it is two points off.
Andy
Yeah, but I guess if you compare it to like the, what was it, like Scunthorpe we played, quite similar. We were up 2-1 up in the second half. fell back 2-3-2 down. So in that situation, we didn't get it back and this one we did.
Andy
So it's better, certainly. But yeah, it was a winnable batch, let's face it.
Mike Dowling
Okay, and Mark, what about you? Two points lost or a point gained on the match overall?
Mark
I mean, you know, I thought we were the better side in the first half, not by a huge margin, but I thought we deserved that half-time lead. They'd hit the post and had another shot just across the face, so they'd hinted that they were well capable of scoring. So when they equalised, it wasn't a huge surprise, and arguably they deserved a goal at that point. Then we went 2-1 up.
Mark
And I thought at that point, we needed to really dig in and defend that lead or add to it. And we didn't. It was a defensive disaster for their equalizer.
Speaker 1
And they
Mark
went ahead. So things went from bad to worse quite quickly. And it was only that extended stoppage time that allowed us to get the point in the end. But I think we, at 2-1, we should have closed the game down, seen it out.
Mark
I'm.
Mike Dowling
You've already hinted, Mark, what does this mean for the season? I mean, we're still second from bottom, as you said, even if we win our next game,
Speaker 1
there's no
Mike Dowling
guarantee of getting out of it. We're now 22 points off the top. Are you suggesting that the title charge is not going to happen at this
Mark
stage? I actually booked a holiday on the Isle of Mull for early May, because way back early this year, I had to book it up really early. I had a worry that something would get into the playoffs at the end of this season and I'd miss one or two playoff games because I was up on the Scottish Islands but that fear has now been extinguished by our poor start to this season so it's no longer a concern.
Mark
I wish Chris all the best, but my feeling after yesterday's result is that he's really got his work cut out to keep us up. I don't think he's going to do it with the current squad of players. I think he needs to bring in some other players. Whether the budget allows that, will allow that, I don't know.
Mark
Maybe he needs to look at the loan market. When Steve Morrison took over, as you know, he brought in quite a few players, most of them on loan, and they did make a difference. I mean, the results didn't improve straight away, but they did improve. I think that the performances and eventually the results did start to come, and I think the situation now is somewhat similar.
Mark
Obviously, it's earlier in the season, but I just think that the current group of players is not performing to quite the right level. We're not a million miles off. We're not getting thrashed. Most of the games we're losing, we're losing by the odd goal, So we're not a huge distance away from where we need to be.
Mark
But I get the sense that this group of players, as I said, is not quite there. And there needs to be some strengthening if we're going to get out the bottom four, let alone head for the playoffs.
Mike Dowling
And what would successful look like to you? What would you, at this point, would you say that has been? Fifth
Speaker 4
from
Mike Dowling
bottom. Andy, now the reason I mentioned the 22 points, I'm fairly sure that Ipswich were about 24 or 25 points ahead of us and it was Christmas time and we made that up.
Speaker 1
Surely
Mike Dowling
we can make it up on Rochdale. How do you feel the season is going to pan out? What's successful for you?
Andy
Well, now success is, yeah, fifth and bottom staying up. And that's going to be difficult. We're already looking like we can't drift a bit. But for me, how can you change it?
Andy
For me, as I said earlier, He's the lack of experience in the team, which you do need when you're in a relegation battle. I don't know about Calyx, would you? He's maybe one of our more experienced players, and he's not available at the moment. I don't know when he's going to return.
Andy
I
Mike Dowling
think he's very close. I don't know anything. I wouldn't be surprised if he saw some minutes on Tuesday. But I don't have any detail.
Mike Dowling
I don't know.
Andy
I don't know how much funding we've got for players and whether the new manager is going to be able to bring in players. As Mark said, a lot of these games we're in, we're competitive. We're not getting fresh every week. It wouldn't take much to turn it around.
Andy
We are starting to maybe run out of time. We can't afford to be too far off
Mike Dowling
But the next game is against West Ham on the 21st on Tuesday night and then looking further ahead. We've got Willstone away on Saturday. How important to you will the National League Cup be, Andy? Do you feel it's a game that we need to go out, build the run, get the confidence going?
Mike Dowling
Or are you happy to just go, it doesn't matter what happens in that game, and a prediction for each of the games that you're not stuck to? You can obviously enter the league. Because by the way, you're doing really well in the league, but carry on with your
Andy
predictions. So yeah, I didn't even realize it was for the Cup game this week. We just need to pin that, to be honest. And I guess looking ahead to Wheelstone again, like they lost 4-0 yesterday.
Andy
Like that could be one that we could pick something up from. Yeah, I've been quite pessimistic in my predictions in the actual league, which is why I'm doing quite well, I think. So I doubt whether I'll be predicting a win in that, but I'm kind of hopeful that Maybe we could we could pick something up But yeah, yeah, I think maybe I'm not talking about the cup Pick up a point Excellent
Mike Dowling
mark, how do you feel about the next two games? I
Mark
Well, I don't go to the National League Cup games. I don't think we should be in the competition at all. So I don't really care about the results. But I understand, effectively, how anywhere having lost the first two games won very heavily.
Mark
So, you know, I have no interest in what happens on
Mike Dowling
Tuesday, really. So I'm not sure what happened there, but I seem to have lost the two guys there. But Andy is top of the prediction league. He's one point ahead of Gemini.
Mike Dowling
Gemini has gone for a 3-1 win against West Ham and with Brandon's score and 2-2 against Woldstone with Nadder's score. I'm going for an early prediction for both and I'm going to go for 2-0 against the West Ham under-21s with Nadas to score and a 3-2 win against Wildstone with Siemens to score. But we are going to wrap up this episode of Sutton Unites Talk Time on podcast. We appreciate everyone's attention and feedback.
Mike Dowling
Like, follow, share this episode on social medias at at Sutton Podcast, give me the thumbs up and all the rest of the stuff that boosts the ego. Subscribe, leave us a review, whatever you want to do. As always, thank you to Lucky Star Gin. Big thank you to today's guest, Andy and Mark.
Mike Dowling
And thanks for you for listening. I hope you've enjoyed this podcast and we'll take care. We'll see you soon.
Speaker 4
Bye-bye.
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